Editing How to rebuild a Rochester Quadrajet 4MV carburetor
Line 4: | Line 4: | ||
The article is also meant to complement the rebuild guide books available, shedding extra light on any topic or procedure that may require further explanation. In the future, as time allows for updates, the article will cite sections and passages from related books to help the reader follow along with ease. | The article is also meant to complement the rebuild guide books available, shedding extra light on any topic or procedure that may require further explanation. In the future, as time allows for updates, the article will cite sections and passages from related books to help the reader follow along with ease. | ||
− | Although the article specifically deals with the Rochester Quadrajet (aka "Q-jet, qjet, etc.) 4MV model, the information found here is useful for working on other Rochester Q-jet models | + | Although the article specifically deals with the Rochester Quadrajet (aka "Q-jet, qjet, etc.) 4MV model, the information found here is useful for working on other Rochester Q-jet models as well. |
At times, the reader may encounter differing viewpoints, especially when dealing with certain repair options. It is up to the reader to decide which method works best. If confusion persists or further advice is needed, it is highly recommended that the reader visit the [http://www.hotrodders.com Hotrodders] forum and ask for assistance from fellow members. | At times, the reader may encounter differing viewpoints, especially when dealing with certain repair options. It is up to the reader to decide which method works best. If confusion persists or further advice is needed, it is highly recommended that the reader visit the [http://www.hotrodders.com Hotrodders] forum and ask for assistance from fellow members. | ||
Line 29: | Line 29: | ||
For decoding the carb number, please see the following article for further information and assistance: '''[[Rochester Quadrajet carburetors: Identification and decoding]]''' | For decoding the carb number, please see the following article for further information and assistance: '''[[Rochester Quadrajet carburetors: Identification and decoding]]''' | ||
[[File:Carburetor_Identification_Number.jpg|thumb|center|750x250px|Location of 1968-up Q-jet carb number. Before this the carb number was stamped into a round disc located on the driver side of the carb, towards the front]] | [[File:Carburetor_Identification_Number.jpg|thumb|center|750x250px|Location of 1968-up Q-jet carb number. Before this the carb number was stamped into a round disc located on the driver side of the carb, towards the front]] | ||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
===B. Parts=== | ===B. Parts=== | ||
Line 205: | Line 194: | ||
*Jets | *Jets | ||
*Fuel Filter Housing | *Fuel Filter Housing | ||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
====Base/throttle body==== | ====Base/throttle body==== | ||
Line 219: | Line 201: | ||
====Trouble spots==== | ====Trouble spots==== | ||
Please keep an eye on the following areas during dis-assembly and rebuild. | Please keep an eye on the following areas during dis-assembly and rebuild. | ||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
=====Stripped or loose/damaged fuel inlet threads===== | =====Stripped or loose/damaged fuel inlet threads===== | ||
Line 249: | Line 218: | ||
=====Leaking float bowl well plugs===== | =====Leaking float bowl well plugs===== | ||
− | A common problem | + | A common problem on the early (1968-back) Q-jets especially, is leaky main wells. The early leak-prone plugs can be identified by being brass cup-type plugs as opposed to aluminum. The late-type plugs are shown below, left- front plugs arrows, rear plugs circled. The 'cure' for this has long been to use JB Weld, etc. to seal them over. This is just a stop-gap measure, the epoxy will degrade and quit sealing. |
The well plug stop-leak pads that come in many rebuild kits are a joke (below, center and right). They will seal the leaking rear plugs for a few heat cycles before shrinking down to a fraction of their former thickness. The result is the carb will initially run as it should, ''quickly'' followed by the same symptoms of a leaky plug returning. Do not waste your time with them. If you have a leaking plug, repair it right. | The well plug stop-leak pads that come in many rebuild kits are a joke (below, center and right). They will seal the leaking rear plugs for a few heat cycles before shrinking down to a fraction of their former thickness. The result is the carb will initially run as it should, ''quickly'' followed by the same symptoms of a leaky plug returning. Do not waste your time with them. If you have a leaking plug, repair it right. | ||
Line 255: | Line 224: | ||
[[File:Q jet well plugs.jpg|400px]][[File:WELL PLUG 1.jpg|295px]][[File:WELL PLUG 2.jpg]] | [[File:Q jet well plugs.jpg|400px]][[File:WELL PLUG 1.jpg|295px]][[File:WELL PLUG 2.jpg]] | ||
− | + | FWIW, there is an epoxy by Devcon (made in the USA, look for "Devcon Home"). It comes in the older 2 tube packages and the newer double plunger syringe type. On the back it clearly states it <u>*RESISTS UNLEADED FUEL*</u>, salt, gasoline, oil etc. Full set time 8-12 hrs/2500 psi. However, be aware there is no empirical evidence that this epoxy will work for the life of the carb without any delamination or degradation. Ruggles also mentions using Marine Tex epoxy to seal the threads of replacement well plugs, but he states that using epoxy alone to repair a leaking well plug is akin to "cutting your arm off and putting a Band-Aid on it". | |
− | + | ||
− | + | ||
− | + | ||
− | + | ||
− | + | ||
− | FWIW, there is an epoxy by Devcon (made in the USA, look for "Devcon Home"). It comes in the older 2 tube packages and the newer double plunger syringe type. On the back it clearly states it <u>*RESISTS UNLEADED FUEL*</u>, salt, gasoline, oil etc. Full set time 8-12 hrs/2500 psi. However, be aware there is no empirical evidence that this epoxy will work for the life of the carb without any delamination or degradation. | + | |
So, if a '''''permanent''''' fix is wanted, the wells can be resealed with new plugs that are peened over to hold them in place, or the wells can be drilled and tapped for plugs that will seal them for good. The primary wells seldom leak, the secondary wells on the early (1968-back) carbs do leak much more often than the later carbs. | So, if a '''''permanent''''' fix is wanted, the wells can be resealed with new plugs that are peened over to hold them in place, or the wells can be drilled and tapped for plugs that will seal them for good. The primary wells seldom leak, the secondary wells on the early (1968-back) carbs do leak much more often than the later carbs. | ||
Line 279: | Line 242: | ||
Throttle return springs used as shown below should be avoided: | Throttle return springs used as shown below should be avoided: | ||
[[File:Throttle return bad.jpg|thumb|800px|left|Bad throttle return spring orientation]] <br style="clear:both"/> | [[File:Throttle return bad.jpg|thumb|800px|left|Bad throttle return spring orientation]] <br style="clear:both"/> | ||
− | |||
− | |||
=====No drilling/Teflon bushing fix===== | =====No drilling/Teflon bushing fix===== | ||
Line 298: | Line 259: | ||
Should a screw get broken off in the shaft, it can be removed by whatever method available; often drilling is done but be careful to get centered on the broken screw. A drill press is the way to do this best, with the throttle plate clamped down. There's no need to worry about matching the screw sizes side-to-side, in other words, if only one screw broke off, use the other original threaded hole along with the larger hole made for the broken screw. Just use the next larger size and use loctite as well as "peening" the ends of the screws. The original screw thread size is 3-48, however the holes can be opened up enough to use a larger screw like a 6-32 thread if need be. | Should a screw get broken off in the shaft, it can be removed by whatever method available; often drilling is done but be careful to get centered on the broken screw. A drill press is the way to do this best, with the throttle plate clamped down. There's no need to worry about matching the screw sizes side-to-side, in other words, if only one screw broke off, use the other original threaded hole along with the larger hole made for the broken screw. Just use the next larger size and use loctite as well as "peening" the ends of the screws. The original screw thread size is 3-48, however the holes can be opened up enough to use a larger screw like a 6-32 thread if need be. | ||
− | + | To do the peening, you can clamp a piece of square stock into a vice to use as an anvil to support the screw head on, then peen the ends of the screws with a small jeweler's hammer or ball peen. You don't need to simulate the factory way of staking; the main idea is to disrupt the threads on the end of the screw so they cannot fall into the engine. The loctite will do the rest. | |
− | + | ||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
If the ends of the screws look too long, they can be ground down with a dremel or small file to the approximate length of the stock screws before peening them. | If the ends of the screws look too long, they can be ground down with a dremel or small file to the approximate length of the stock screws before peening them. | ||
+ | |||
+ | The secondary throttle shaft do not need bushings. If the secondary shaft/throttle plate bore is that bad, the rest of the carb is likely worn badly; another core or at a least another throttle plate should be considered. | ||
=====Cleaning orifices===== | =====Cleaning orifices===== | ||
− | + | Please see posts numbers 23 through 28 on page 2 in the thread ''[http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/rochester-quadrajet-4mv-carburetor-removal-disassembly-rebuild-rookie-level-190558-2.html Rochester Quadrajet 4MV Carburetor: Removal, Disassembly, Rebuild (Rookie Level)]''. | |
− | + | ||
− | + | ||
− | + | ||
− | + | ||
− | + | ||
− | + | ||
=====Throttle blades===== | =====Throttle blades===== | ||
Line 332: | Line 283: | ||
=====Soaking the parts===== | =====Soaking the parts===== | ||
{{Caution}}According to [http://www.hotrodders.com Hotrodders] forum member '''''trees''''': | {{Caution}}According to [http://www.hotrodders.com Hotrodders] forum member '''''trees''''': | ||
− | <blockquote>''"Soaking all metallic parts is the way to go but using small brushes lightly is a good | + | <blockquote>''"Soaking all metallic parts is the way to go but using small brushes lightly is a good ideal. Do not soak non-metallic items." ^''</blockquote> |
=====Cleaning with brushes and wires===== | =====Cleaning with brushes and wires===== | ||
Line 352: | Line 303: | ||
=====Base/throttle plate===== | =====Base/throttle plate===== | ||
− | {{Note1}}Sometimes the Q-jet base plate may be missing a screw or two (there are only two on most carbs; three at the most). While the base plate is "helped" being held on by the two long front intake manifold mounting bolts and the two long screws at the rear of the carb, it's still a good idea to replace the missing screws. Just be sure to not over tighten these long bolts. If they're over tightened, it can warp the carb permanently. | + | {{Note1}}Sometimes the Q-jet base plate may be missing a screw or two (there are only two on most carbs; three at the most). While the base plate is "helped" being held on by the two long front intake manifold mounting bolts and the two long screws at the rear of the carb, it's still a good idea to replace the missing screws. Just be sure to not over tighten these long bolts. If they're over tightened, it can warp the carb permanently. |
=====Float/fuel bowl===== | =====Float/fuel bowl===== | ||
Line 373: | Line 324: | ||
===G. Re-installation=== | ===G. Re-installation=== | ||
− | + | ---- | |
− | + | ||
− | + | ||
− | + | ||
− | + | ||
− | + | ||
− | + | ||
− | + | ||
− | + | ||
{{Caution}}Tighten the carb to the thick insulator-type gasket evenly but not too tightly. Because the gasket of that type has a lot of give to it, it can cause the base plate to warp- sometimes enough to cause the throttle shafts/blades to bind. In severe enough cases the baseplate can even crack. | {{Caution}}Tighten the carb to the thick insulator-type gasket evenly but not too tightly. Because the gasket of that type has a lot of give to it, it can cause the base plate to warp- sometimes enough to cause the throttle shafts/blades to bind. In severe enough cases the baseplate can even crack. | ||
− | + | {{Caution}}Do not overtighten the vacuum fitting used for the power brake booster (or any other application requiring a high flow, manifold vacuum source). The casting can crack if the male pipe threads of the fitting are overtightened. | |
− | + | ||
− | + | Seal the fitting with teflon tape or a good thread sealant. Either of these will also act as a lubricant, making overtightening a lot easier than if the threads were dry, so be careful. | |
− | + | ||
− | + | ||
− | + | ||
− | + | ||
− | Seal the | + | |
− | + | ||
− | + | ||
==Tuning== | ==Tuning== | ||
Line 412: | Line 347: | ||
[http://vetteworks.tripod.com/qjet.htm Rochester 4MC, 4MV, M4MC, and E4ME Carburetors] from vetteworks.tripod.com | [http://vetteworks.tripod.com/qjet.htm Rochester 4MC, 4MV, M4MC, and E4ME Carburetors] from vetteworks.tripod.com | ||
− | ===Idle | + | ===Idle problems=== |
*[http://www.73-87.com/7387garage/drivetrain/qjetidle.htm Q-jet Idle Problems] from 73-87.com | *[http://www.73-87.com/7387garage/drivetrain/qjetidle.htm Q-jet Idle Problems] from 73-87.com | ||
Line 419: | Line 354: | ||
This is providing that the throttle plates are not open too far due to a large cam- which will over-expose the transfer slot, just like on a Holley. The cure for that is the same as you'd do with a Holley- start by using more ignition advance. This allows the primary throttle blades to be closed down some to lower the idle speed, which increases due to the advanced timing. Often, this is all that's needed, so be sure to do this FIRST, then enlarge the ports only if still needed. Normally, going larger than 0.0100" isn't needed and if the idle screws are still not responsive at this size, the problem lies elsewhere- like needing idle bypass air (or more bypass air). | This is providing that the throttle plates are not open too far due to a large cam- which will over-expose the transfer slot, just like on a Holley. The cure for that is the same as you'd do with a Holley- start by using more ignition advance. This allows the primary throttle blades to be closed down some to lower the idle speed, which increases due to the advanced timing. Often, this is all that's needed, so be sure to do this FIRST, then enlarge the ports only if still needed. Normally, going larger than 0.0100" isn't needed and if the idle screws are still not responsive at this size, the problem lies elsewhere- like needing idle bypass air (or more bypass air). | ||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
− | |||
===Power piston=== | ===Power piston=== | ||
Line 463: | Line 378: | ||
|} | |} | ||
− | Edelbrock has four different PP springs: gold (4"/Hg), orange (5"/Hg), black (6"/Hg), and yellow (8"/Hg) in their p/n | + | Edelbrock has four different PP springs: gold (4"/Hg), orange (5"/Hg), black (6"/Hg), and yellow (8"/Hg) in their p/n 1980 spring kit. These springs are also available in their "Race Calibration Kit" that contains a selection of main jets and rods, secondary rods, hangars, PP springs, high flow needle and seat and an accelerator pump. There are also other suppliers of PP springs and other various tune up and repair parts; see the links below this section. |
*GM power piston spring p/n 7037305 is set for a tip in point of ~6 in/Hg, and would work well with a high vacuum, smooth idling and/or wide LSA type cam. | *GM power piston spring p/n 7037305 is set for a tip in point of ~6 in/Hg, and would work well with a high vacuum, smooth idling and/or wide LSA type cam. | ||
Line 565: | Line 480: | ||
Also, everywhere the casting is ground on or polished removes the protective finish from the zinc of the carb body, and that can lead to the dreaded attack of the "white stuff" that's mentioned anytime old carbs are talked about. | Also, everywhere the casting is ground on or polished removes the protective finish from the zinc of the carb body, and that can lead to the dreaded attack of the "white stuff" that's mentioned anytime old carbs are talked about. | ||
− | == | + | ===Changes to calibrations=== |
− | + | As far as jetting and calibrations, they have to be optimized for the engine anyway- and without knowing whether the carb was spot-on, lean or rich to begin with- and what the smoothing, etc. to the castings did to the flow and air/fuel ratio, there's no way anyone can say you will need to add or remove fuel, nor what circuits may be affected, or even if one circuit may want more fuel while another circuit wants less. So instead of worrying about any changes caused by the work you're contemplating doing, plan on taking care of all of it when the carb is set up for the engine and vehicle. | |
− | + | Lastly, there's a lot more to be had in setting up the APT, idle/transition and main circuits, and the secondary tip-in than there is in dickering with the castings. | |
− | + | ||
− | + | ||
==Quadrajet tuning and repair parts== | ==Quadrajet tuning and repair parts== | ||
Line 578: | Line 491: | ||
*[http://www.carbkitsource.com/ The Carburetor Doctor] | *[http://www.carbkitsource.com/ The Carburetor Doctor] | ||
*[http://www.edelbrock.com/ Edelbrock] | *[http://www.edelbrock.com/ Edelbrock] | ||
− | : | + | :[[How to rebuild a Rochester Quadrajet 4MV carburetor#Individual parts|Return to '''''Individual parts''''']], above. |
==Recommended Resources== | ==Recommended Resources== | ||
− | |||
− | |||
===A. Wiki articles and Hotrodders Knowledge Base links=== | ===A. Wiki articles and Hotrodders Knowledge Base links=== | ||
---- | ---- | ||
Line 634: | Line 545: | ||
;[http://home.earthlink.net/~quadrajets/quadrajet_airflow_ratings.htm '''''Quadrajet Air Flow Ratings'''''] by GRZ | ;[http://home.earthlink.net/~quadrajets/quadrajet_airflow_ratings.htm '''''Quadrajet Air Flow Ratings'''''] by GRZ | ||
− | :Discusses the Quadrajet's air flow ratings from | + | :Discusses the Quadrajet's air flow ratings from factory, and tips on modifying or replacing the air valve shaft, the secondary metering rods and hangar, and the cam follower for maximum air flow. |
;[http://www.arkansaspontiacs.org/techstories/RockyQ-jets.htm '''''How Well Do You Know Your Rochester Quadrajet'''''] by Rocky Rotella | ;[http://www.arkansaspontiacs.org/techstories/RockyQ-jets.htm '''''How Well Do You Know Your Rochester Quadrajet'''''] by Rocky Rotella | ||
Line 647: | Line 558: | ||
:''[http://www.recarbco.com/technical/rochester/qjet.html Recarbo Fuel Systems]'' - ''"This guide is just that: a guide. It is not set in stone, because it is a documented fact that Rochester didn't follow these rules 100%."'' | :''[http://www.recarbco.com/technical/rochester/qjet.html Recarbo Fuel Systems]'' - ''"This guide is just that: a guide. It is not set in stone, because it is a documented fact that Rochester didn't follow these rules 100%."'' | ||
− | :''[http://www.carbkitsource.com/carbs/numbers/Rochester/Quadrajet/index.html Rochester Quadrajet Carburetor Numerical Index]'' - From [http://www.carbkitsource.com/ "The Carburetor Doctor"]. | + | :''[http://www.carbkitsource.com/carbs/numbers/Rochester/Quadrajet/index.html Rochester Quadrajet Carburetor Numerical Index]'' - From [http://www.carbkitsource.com/ "The Carburetor Doctor"]. |
==References== | ==References== | ||
Line 661: | Line 572: | ||
[[File:Q-JET FILTER HOUSING GASKETS.jpg|thumb|300px|left|The two most used carb filter housing gaskets. Earliest was 7/8" (and are rare), later were all 1", early had gasket over the threads, late style had white gasket on end of housing before threads]] | [[File:Q-JET FILTER HOUSING GASKETS.jpg|thumb|300px|left|The two most used carb filter housing gaskets. Earliest was 7/8" (and are rare), later were all 1", early had gasket over the threads, late style had white gasket on end of housing before threads]] | ||
[[File:REBUILT CARB TELL-TAIL PIN TO BLOCK INCORRECT AIR CLEANER STUD INSTALLATION.jpg|thumb|300px|left|Dead give-away of a rebuilt carb: Arrow points to tell-tail pin installed by rebuilders to keep the air cleaner stud from being inserted into the wrong hole]] | [[File:REBUILT CARB TELL-TAIL PIN TO BLOCK INCORRECT AIR CLEANER STUD INSTALLATION.jpg|thumb|300px|left|Dead give-away of a rebuilt carb: Arrow points to tell-tail pin installed by rebuilders to keep the air cleaner stud from being inserted into the wrong hole]] | ||
+ | [[File:TYPICAL MANUAL TRANS Q-JET THROTTLE ARM.jpg|thumb|300px|left|Manual or TH400 trans throttle arm that's missing the portion below the throttle shaft center line where the detent/TV cable would be attached]] | ||
[[File:Secondary rods 002.jpg|thumb|300px|left|Selection of secondary metering rods: Lean left, rich middle, medium right]] | [[File:Secondary rods 002.jpg|thumb|300px|left|Selection of secondary metering rods: Lean left, rich middle, medium right]] | ||
[[File:CHOKE BIMETAL COILS 2.jpg|thumb|300px|left|Several types of hot air choke thermostats]] | [[File:CHOKE BIMETAL COILS 2.jpg|thumb|300px|left|Several types of hot air choke thermostats]] | ||
[[File:CHOKE HOT AIR SEVERAL TYPES.jpg|thumb|300px|left|Several types of hot air choke housings]] | [[File:CHOKE HOT AIR SEVERAL TYPES.jpg|thumb|300px|left|Several types of hot air choke housings]] | ||
+ | {{youcanedit}} | ||
[[Category:Engine]] | [[Category:Engine]] | ||
[[Category:Carburetors]] | [[Category:Carburetors]] | ||
+ | [[Category:Good articles]] | ||
+ | [[Category:GM]] |